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10/05/2017 5:10 am  #1

Please Explain

Can someone here write an intelligent  defense for it?

I have never understood the conservative fetish for the Second Amendment.

From a law-and-order standpoint, more guns means more murder. “States with higher rates of gun ownership had disproportionately large numbers of deaths from firearm-related homicides,” noted one exhaustive 2013 study in the American Journal of Public Health.

From a personal-safety standpoint, more guns means less safety. The F.B.I. counted a total of 268 “justifiable homicides” by private citizens involving firearms in 2015; that is, felons killed in the course of committing a felony. Yet that same year, there were 489 “unintentional firearms deaths” in the United States, according to the Centers for Disease Control. Between 77 and 141 of those killed were children.

From a national-security standpoint, the Amendment’s suggestion that a “well-regulated militia” is “necessary to the security of a free State,” is quaint. The Minutemen that will deter Vladimir Putin and Kim Jong-un are based in missile silos in Minot, N.D., not farmhouses in Lexington, Mass.

From a personal liberty standpoint, the idea that an armed citizenry is the ultimate check on the ambitions and encroachments of government power is curious. The Whiskey Rebellion of the 1790s, the New York draft riots of 1863, the coal miners’ rebellion of 1921, the Brink’s robbery of 1981 — does any serious conservative think of these as great moments in Second Amendment activism?

(From Bret Stephens, NYT)

Please, take an opportunity - being scrupulous to avoid insults - to lay out an argument for the Second Amendment.
I simply do not get it, the argument, the intense emotion,,,,, I'm at a loss.

We live in a time in which decent and otherwise sensible people are surrendering too easily to the hectoring of morons or extremists. 

10/05/2017 6:15 am  #2

Re: Please Explain

An idea that kind of passed when muskets went out of style ! 

"Do not confuse motion and progress, A rocking horse keeps moving but does not make any progress"

10/05/2017 6:32 am  #3

Re: Please Explain

I have been there and done that with what passes for the gun "debate" in this country.
I'm not looking for a legal argument. Not looking to be insulted or to have dark motives attributed to me. I am
Looking for someone to set anger, hyperbole, and emotion aside,,,,,, and to explain to us, one reasonable adult to another, what good things come to 2017 America from the second amendment.

Last edited by Goose (10/05/2017 6:34 am)

We live in a time in which decent and otherwise sensible people are surrendering too easily to the hectoring of morons or extremists. 
     Thread Starter

10/05/2017 7:51 am  #4

Re: Please Explain

I've struggled with the question for years, now.  I have no answers, only a couple of observations.

First, I have a problem relating to the mindset of some gun owners, not all.  For example, my next door neighbor is a gun owner ............. he belongs to a gun club where they have skeet-shooting competitions and he hunts.  He used to belong to the NRA, but he told me he canceled his membership years ago.

Secondly, I think every nation has some kind of group personality that is reflected in general terms of how they view life and what is important.  I can't put my finger on what that may exactly mean.

Thirdly, it seems the ever-changing technology of weaponry has surpassed the citizenry's maturity in its ability to handle it.  We've seen this handled in other areas, but not when it comes to guns.  For example, witness the technology involved in the evolution of the automobile.  As cars became more powerful, we stepped in with rules and regulations to make them safer ......... air bags, anti-lock braking systems, car seats, turn signals, seat belts, etc.  On top of that, there are rules associated with it's use that have been implemented over time ...... age minimums, registration, passing a driving test, speed limits, licensing, and requiring liability insurance.  For some reason we can't seem to apply the same approach to gun ownership.

I'm at a loss for answers.  I only have a few observations. 


10/05/2017 11:28 am  #5

Re: Please Explain

I was really taken aback by some of the videos from LV. You can hear the gunfire. And the rate of fire is just incredible. How could someone think that weapons capable of doing that after a minor modification are appropriate for the civilian population?


Last edited by Goose (10/05/2017 11:35 am)

We live in a time in which decent and otherwise sensible people are surrendering too easily to the hectoring of morons or extremists. 
     Thread Starter

10/07/2017 8:16 pm  #6

Re: Please Explain

My biggest issue with the second amendment is people screaming about the right to own a deadly weapon while carefully avoiding mentioning the responsibility...or apparent lack of

If you make yourself miserable trying to make others happy that means everyone is miserable.

-Me again


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