The New Exchange

You are not logged in. Would you like to login or register?



1/04/2016 9:32 am  #1


Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

USA –  -(Ammoland.com)-“Armed protesters, including three sons of a Nevada rancher who battled with the government in 2014, vowed to occupy a federal building in Oregon for ‘as long as it takes,’ as state and federal officials on Sunday sought to defuse the situation,” Fox News, among others, is reporting.

http://www.ammoland.com/2016/01/powder-keg-occupation-of-oregon-wildlife-refuge-just-needs-a-spark/#axzz3wEOfwjZx

It’s a dangerous situation some of us have been following since yesterday’s takeover of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge headquarters following a protest in support of rancher Dwight Hammond and his son Steven.

The Hammonds were convicted of arson after a fire they said they started on their property to burn off wildfire-threatening invasive species inadvertently spread onto federal land, consuming 139 acres.  The government charged they were covering up evidence of poaching, and the jury bought the prosecution’s arguments.

A new controversy arose after it was ruled the trial court sentence was not harsh enough, and Chief Judge Ann Aiken of the United States District Court for the District of Oregon tacked on an additional five years.“The Hammond family does not want an armed standoff, and nobody has a right to force one on them,” Oath Keepers told its members. “Since Dwight and Steven Hammond, through their attorney, have made it clear they intend to turn themselves in and serve out the additional time, Oath Keepers cannot, and will not, try to interfere with that decision (peaceable assembly and protest is, of course, fine, but going beyond that against their wishes is not).”“The 3% of Idaho, 3% of Oregon, The Oregon Constitutional Guard, and PPN organizations in no way condone nor support these actions,” the 3% of Oregon declared in a Facebook press release. “They do not mirror our vision, mission statement, or views in regards to upholding the Constitution, The Rule of Law, or Due Process.

Also complicating matters for the protesters, some of the locals are scared. And the ranchers at the heart of the dispute, through their lawyer, declared they have nothing to do with the takeover.Ammond Bundy disagrees with Oath Keepers, says the Hammonds distancing themselves has been coerced after government threats, and has put out a call for people to come to Oregon and support his actions.

So now what we have is a serious split between some who do not agree with Bundy’s methods, and an angry backlash against anyone speaking out against his actions, with plenty of name-calling going in both directions.That schism has to please those who benefit from an opportunity to “divide and conquer,” and that’s very apparent on social media.

But here’s the thing — even if you are someone who opposes the action, you’re still affected by it.  Like it or not, we’re all in it up to our necks.That’s because the monopoly of violence “progressives” will use the Oregon occupation to tar everyone who believes in the right to keep and bear arms as an “insurrectionist,” an “extremist” and a “domestic terrorist.” That will be extended to mainstream groups like NRA, always a convenient media punching bag. And the smear job won’t be limited to gun rights defenders. Expect it to cover anyone who espouses “conservative” values.

And expect attacks on the Republicans, especially on the presidential candidates.Don’t be surprised to see some in the GOP reconsider how committed they’re willing to be opposing Obama’s anticipated executive orders. And don’t’ be surprised to see the administration looking to emergency powers to deal not just with the Oregon situation, but to do whatever they think they can get away.  Don‘t be surprised to see Democrats, gun-grabber groups and the press cheering it on.

There are still plenty of unknowns, including how many people are actually at the wildlife refuge, and what it is that would induce them to depart. When questioned by CNN, Ammon Bundy spoke in general terms, making it sound like nothing less than the dismantling of the federal Leviathan is what it will take. His colleague John Ritzenheimer sounded more fatalistic, in what could be characterized as a “goodbye” video message to his family.So what are the administration’s options? 

Assuming functionaries had their New Years weekends cut short, you can bet they‘re focus-grouping and war-gaming, and weighing scenarios and options. You can also bet special tactical teams are on alert, if not on their way — and if DOJ approaches this as domestic terrorism, the feds will totally marginalize the local sheriff.

They could talk the guys down, although from the rhetoric of the takeover leaders and Bundy’s conviction that he is carrying out the Lord’s will, that doesn’t sound likely. If they do come out, don’t expect the Justice Department to show leniency.They could lay siege and wait them out, turn off all power and water, and see if a week or two might soften some resolve. On the other hand, depending on how many answer Bundy‘s call, the enforcers could find the greater cause for their concern is amassing outside their perimeter.The third option would be to go full Waco, making sure the media is kept back so the narrative could be whatever they wanted to put out through a spokesman.

It’s been done before.That’s why an analysis by Mike Vanderboegh on his Sipsey Street Irregulars blog is important for the government (and for all of us) to understand, so that people with access to decision-makers know, in no uncertain terms, the precipitous situation a brutal reaction will produce — for everyone.If things blow up in Oregon, things could quickly get out of control everywhere, and while we can only imagine what that will look like, the certainty is things would be ugly and prolonged.


 “We hold these truths to be self-evident,”  former vice president Biden said during a campaign event in Texas on Monday. "All men and women created by — you know, you know, the thing.”

 
 

1/04/2016 9:48 am  #2


Re: Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

Common Sense wrote:

It’s been done before.That’s why an analysis by Mike Vanderboegh on his Sipsey Street Irregulars blog is important for the government (and for all of us) to understand, so that people with access to decision-makers know, in no uncertain terms, the precipitous situation a brutal reaction will produce — for everyone.If things blow up in Oregon, things could quickly get out of control everywhere, and while we can only imagine what that will look like, the certainty is things would be ugly and prolonged.

I hate to disagree with something so prestigious as ammoland.com and David Codrea who blogs at “The War on Guns: Notes from the Resistance,”

But, I don't see "Things blowing up everywhere" if these criminals are taken into custody. That seems more like an extremist fantasy than a likely scenario.

In any event, if things blow up in Oregon the people responsible will be those armed thugs who took over the building in the first place.

If an inner city street thug gets his neck broken in the back of a police van, people will rationalize police actions with the argument  that he broke the law in the first place. Would anyone recomend going easy on criminals in Baltimore just because vigorous police action might lead to riots? I sure didn't see anyone advocating that in the conservative blogosphere.

So, I just don't get why we should coddle these guys.
Is it the flags? The hiding criminal activity in blather about the Constitution?

 


We live in a time in which decent and otherwise sensible people are surrendering too easily to the hectoring of morons or extremists. 
 

1/04/2016 10:56 am  #3


Re: Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

In my opinion, there is nothing that these open carry, pseudo militia, anti-government, bunker prepper, false patriotic nincompoops want more than an armed confrontation with legal authorities. Somewhere in their defective cro-magnum brains, they envision a shootout with the police, FBI, National Guard, U.S. Marshals, Seal Team 6, or whoever will somehow justify their illegal actions and make some point about how the government is infringing upon their rights. To me, that illogic premise and incomprehensible conclusion to their thinking shows nothing more than how far from reason these jerks have wandered.

I'd like to see the legal authorities surround the property, let no one in or out, completely isolate these bozos and see how long they can fend for themselves without the luxuries or basic essentials to which they are accustomed. Then, when they slink out, one by one or a couple at a time, arrest them, throw them in jail with the other lawbreakers, and make them all liable for paying off the total cost of the government operation necessary to keep the peace. And, if one of these mental defects fires one shot in 'defense of their principles', I'd give them 12 hours to surrender or suffer the consequences of an all out assault of government troops on the compound.

 

1/04/2016 11:40 am  #4


Re: Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

Ryan Bundy, part of an armed antigovernment group, walked between occupied buildings at the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge on Sunday. Credit Amanda Peacher/Oregon Public Broadcasting




Unarmed guy tries to walk down a street in Fergusen, MO




Just sayin'


We live in a time in which decent and otherwise sensible people are surrendering too easily to the hectoring of morons or extremists. 
 

1/04/2016 3:57 pm  #5


Re: Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

Sounds like terrorists to me.


If you make yourself miserable trying to make others happy that means everyone is miserable.

-Me again

---------------------------------------------
 

1/04/2016 4:33 pm  #6


Re: Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

Rongone wrote:

In my opinion, there is nothing that these open carry, pseudo militia, anti-government, bunker prepper, false patriotic nincompoops want more than an armed confrontation with legal authorities. Somewhere in their defective cro-magnum brains, they envision a shootout with the police, FBI, National Guard, U.S. Marshals, Seal Team 6, or whoever will somehow justify their illegal actions and make some point about how the government is infringing upon their rights. To me, that illogic premise and incomprehensible conclusion to their thinking shows nothing more than how far from reason these jerks have wandered.

I'd like to see the legal authorities surround the property, let no one in or out, completely isolate these bozos and see how long they can fend for themselves without the luxuries or basic essentials to which they are accustomed. Then, when they slink out, one by one or a couple at a time, arrest them, throw them in jail with the other lawbreakers, and make them all liable for paying off the total cost of the government operation necessary to keep the peace. And, if one of these mental defects fires one shot in 'defense of their principles', I'd give them 12 hours to surrender or suffer the consequences of an all out assault of government troops on the compound.

Maybe if you called then a few more choice names it would help make your point?
Key Board courage... Easy to assault from a key board? Just saying....


 “We hold these truths to be self-evident,”  former vice president Biden said during a campaign event in Texas on Monday. "All men and women created by — you know, you know, the thing.”

 
     Thread Starter
 

1/04/2016 4:36 pm  #7


Re: Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

Knock it off, CS


We live in a time in which decent and otherwise sensible people are surrendering too easily to the hectoring of morons or extremists. 
 

1/04/2016 4:50 pm  #8


Re: Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

Goose wrote:

Ryan Bundy, part of an armed antigovernment group, walked between occupied buildings at the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge on Sunday. Credit Amanda Peacher/Oregon Public Broadcasting




Unarmed guy tries to walk down a street in Fergusen, MO




Just sayin'

I truly think you are on to something. I would report this to the DOJ ASAP. 


 “We hold these truths to be self-evident,”  former vice president Biden said during a campaign event in Texas on Monday. "All men and women created by — you know, you know, the thing.”

 
     Thread Starter
 

1/04/2016 4:54 pm  #9


Re: Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

CS, stop trolling.
If you haven't anything intelligent to offer, please move on.


We live in a time in which decent and otherwise sensible people are surrendering too easily to the hectoring of morons or extremists. 
 

1/05/2016 9:10 am  #10


Re: Powder Keg Occupation of Oregon Wildlife Refuge Just Needs a Spark

This photo display exemplifies why the public does not believe or trust the media.
 
Two photos that do not have any thing in common. Zero! Two completely different
situations. Different places, different time, different circumstances.
We are told that the guy in the top photo is armed? Is he? Or isn’t he?
A group of people mad at the federal government broke into a remote federal building and said they are going to stay in the building unless demands are met.
Burglary, trespassing, destruction of property.
 
Bottom photo
We are told the guy is unarmed? Again Is he or isn’t he. We don’t know.
We are told this was taken in Fergusen, MO. The same Fergusen where the big lie
“Hands Up, Don’t shoot” was born. The same Fergusen  that had people shooting at police,
The same  Fergusen that had very destructive riots, The same Fergusen that bottles, bricks, most anything were thrown at police night after night. The same Fergusen that had a state of emergency declared for several days. The same Fergusen that saw a big majority of their business burned to the ground. Many of the business minority owned. So comparing two different photos don’t mean anything unless you are trying to spin a story. Or make one up?
 
 


 “We hold these truths to be self-evident,”  former vice president Biden said during a campaign event in Texas on Monday. "All men and women created by — you know, you know, the thing.”

 
     Thread Starter
 

Board footera

 

Powered by Boardhost. Create a Free Forum